Report from 2013 ARM kernel summit

Hiroshi Doyu hdoyu at
Wed Nov 20 01:39:55 EST 2013

Hi Rob,

Rob Herring <robherring2 at> wrote @ Tue, 19 Nov 2013 21:45:02 +0100:

> On 11/19/2013 11:35 AM, Will Deacon wrote:
> > On Tue, Nov 19, 2013 at 09:40:54AM +0000, Hiroshi Doyu wrote:
> >> Grant Likely <grant.likely at> wrote @ Fri, 15 Nov 2013 08:06:27 +0100:
> >>> On Mon, 11 Nov 2013 10:47:23 +0100, Hiroshi Doyu <hdoyu at> wrote:
> >>>> 1, When a device is populated, it checks if that device is IOMMU'able
> >>>>    or not. This is identified by "#stream-id-cells" in DT. If
> >>>>    a device is normal(non IOMMU), a device is populated. If a device
> >>>>    is IOMMU'able, it continues to be checked.
> > 
> > [...]
> > 
> >>>> I'm not so sure if this dependecy on "#stream-id-cells" is acceptable
> >>>> or not, but I haven't any better idea right now.
> >>>
> >>> It seems a little fragile to me too. I'd rather the IOMMU requirement be
> >>> described more explicitly.
> I don't see how this can work. Typically you find a property and then
> read the relevant #*-cells to determine the size. Having multiple cell
> properties is asking for errors.

The above was mentioned for PATCHv4 series[1], which used the arm,smmu
DT bindings,  "#stream-id-cells" in clients and "mmu-masters" in

In PATCHv5[2], we took the following DT binding where multiple cell
properties seem to work ok.

  smmu_a: iommu at xxxxxxxx {
  	#iommu-cells = <2>;
  smmu_b: iommu at xxxxxxxx {
  	#iommu-cells = <3>;
  device_a {
  	 iommus = <&smmu_a param1 param2>,
  	 	  <&smmu_b param1 param2 param3>;

This can describe the relation between a device and an iommu
independently. The number of params needed for each IOMMU can be
sepcified by #iommu-cells in its iommu entry.

  device_a <-> smmu_a, needs 2 params for a device
  device_a <-> smmu_b, needs 3 params for a device

For example, "smmu_a" can be an bus level global IOMMU where all child
devices can be an master of "smmu_a", and "smmu_b" is a local IOMMU
only for "device_a".

"memory controller"---"smmu_a"---bus--+--"smmu_b"--"device_a"

> >> I think that Will Deacon can do better than I.
> > 
> > I already commented briefly here:
> > 
> >
> > 
> > basically deferring to DT people :)
> > 
> > Anyway, I'm happy to tighten up the IOMMU requirement description but
> > *not* at the expense of breaking what we currently have for the ARM SMMU,
> > which is being used by Calxeda.
> > 
> > Adding Andreas and Rob for input on potential binding additions to the SMMU.
> The above proposal would be an incompatible change. However, I think we
> could still deal with a change in this binding at this stage.
> One way approach to handle this without changing the binding would be to
> scan the DT for all iommu's up front and create a list of all nodes and
> their iommu parent. The fact that the hierarchy is described in a way
> that doesn't fit Linux well is really a Linux implementation detail.

I may need some implementation to understand this further.

> If changing the binding, a simple approach would be to allow
> 'smmu-parent' to be a bus and/or device property and not just for
> chained iommu's. This could be a global or bus property that is
> inherited. Like interrupt-parent, you would have to deal with the parent
> being itself. Also, perhaps iommu-parent would be a better name. In any
> case, I'd like to see this all be a generic iommu binding.

I guess that this would work.

One concern to this may be that there might be the case where IOMMU
hierarchy doesn't always follow the bus's one, I guess. I'm not so
sure if it's an good example, but, platform_bus itself doesn't follow
the actual bus hierarchy at all. But if we start to describe the bus
hierarchy(adding a specific bus) we'll loose the benefit of
platform_bus, where we can share almost all devices in a single

OTOH, do you see any limitations of point-to-point connections between
a device and IOMMUs, described in the above "device_a" and "smmu_[a|b]"?


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