Fw: Yahoo Mailing List Snafu ...

[Jonathan H]

OK, I humbly acquiesce - it appears that although the configuration is
"unusual" (at least among lists I am on), it's not actually wrong.
I can see your point from the link you posted. Controversial subject!

http://www.mail-list.com/reply-to-sender-reply-to-list-reply-to-all/
> "One of the prime areas of confusion is what happens when you reply to a message from a mailing list.  On some lists, it’s configured to go back to the individual that sent the message.  On other lists, it’s set up to go back to the list."

http://www.gnu.org/software/mailman/mailman-admin/node11.html
> "Beware! Reply-To: munging is considered a religious issue and the policies you set here can ignite some of the most heated off-topic flame wars on your mailing lists."

So, fair enough, you're right, or at least, not wrong. So I'm not sure
now how Yahoo! and other could work around this, or rather, what
better method could be employed to ensure that a sender really is the
sender.

I'm sorry for dragging this off-topic; but it certainly looks like it
needs a more nuanced or clever response from email providers.

On 17 April 2014 20:56, David Woodhouse <dwmw2 at infradead.org> wrote:
> On Thu, 2014-04-17 at 20:46 +0100, Jonathan H wrote:
>> I'm totally lost; I appear to be missing the rest of the thread.
>>
>> Is it related to this? http://www.virusbtn.com/blog/2014/04_15.xml
>
> Basically, Yahoo! have just broken their own email setup for mailing
> lists. They no longer accept messages with 'From: xxxx at yahoo.com' coming
> from elsewhere. Like mailing list servers. Which is how fairly much
> *all* mailing lists behave, when a Yahoo subscriber sends mail to the
> list
>
>> Now, this list is setup in a quite (ahem) "unique" way; I wonder if
>> that might be triggering spam filters?
>
> No, this list is perfectly normal. Especially with regard to the 'From'
> header.
>
>> For example, every single one of the other roughly 25 mailing lists
>> has headers in the form of:
>>
>> from:a at b.com
>> reply-to: list at somelists.org
>> to: list at somelists.org
>
> See? The 'From:' header there was also the original sender of the
> message, right? And would also be broken by Yahoo's recent brain damage.
>
>> but this list has:
>>
>> from: David Woodhouse <xxxx at infradead.org>
>> to: Chris J Brady <xxxx at yahoo.com>
>> cc: get_iplayer <get_iplayer at lists.infradead.org>
>
> The To: and Cc: are entirely interchangeable; that's purely cosmetic.
> You can send To the list or Cc the list as you see fit, and it really
> doesn't make any difference.
>
>> (As anyone who's ever replied, you'll know it plays havoc and requires
>> a fair amount of farting around with
>> I've not idea why it's like this, but David's list, David's rules I suppose.)
>
> Why on earth would you have to do anything other than just hit 'reply to
> all'?
>
> I think you're confused and think that it's acceptable to reply *only*
> to the list, and rudely strip other participants from Cc. I recommend
> reading http://david.woodhou.se/reply-to-list.html to correct that
> misconception. (Redux: Either choice inconveniences some people but
> replying only to the list is *more* of a problem and could cut people
> out of the discussion entirely, so don't do that. Keeping people in Cc
> when they don't need it is a trivial cosmetic inconvenience for them at
> worst.)
>
> But that's orthogonal to the Yahoo brokenness.
>
>> In what way is Yahoo in particular "broken" in this case, though? As
>> far as I can see, they are simply enforcing something which is 10
>> years overdue and much needed - ie: no sender spoofing and a valid,
>> signed, authenticated email.
>
> What you describe is not "email". That isn't how email works.
>
> The list sends messages with a reverse-path of
> get_iplayer-owner at lists.infradead.org, which is not spoofed. The From:
> header is also correct according to the standards since it identifies
> the *author* of the email. Yahoo is, as I said, simply broken.
>
> Like other list managers who don't care about pandering to stupidity,
> I'll probably just put a filter on so that the lists automatically
> reject messages from yahoo.com addresses. Here's a nickel, kid. Get a
> proper email account.
>
> --
> dwmw2
>